Posts by FatFreek 2005

87

WTS successfully counters claims it is a "false prophet"

by trthskr in

greetings.. http://www.jehovah.to/xlation/fp.html.

"do not interpretations belong to god?".

but as the saying goes; you can never satisfy a critic.. .

FatFreek 2005

Mankkeli -- ceased posting some 28 days ago (12/6/2011)

trthskr -- began posting on 12/31/2011

ya'll may have hit on something.

56

Hi - I'm new here!

by Flicka in

jw
friends

i have been lurking on this site for the past 2 months.

for the past few years i have been going to the meetings and doing fieldservice out of guilt.. my husband (twisty) told me regularly i only do it out of guilt but i denied it and said it i want to do these things because i love jehovah and it is the right thing to do, but how can it be the right thing if you don't feel welcome and it feels like everyone is judging you the moment you walk into the kingdom hall.. it has taken a few years and a lot of tears to open my eyes.. over the past few years twisty spoke to me about the various things he didn't agree with but it just went over my head.

a few months ago we were lying in bed and he brought up his concerns again, and i'm not sure what was different this time but i understood and agreed with the points he was making.

FatFreek 2005

Flicka: My husband and I are currently doing a lot of reading and trying to document what we are reading so when the day comes when my family has questions I can show them the answers from our research, which I think that is still very far in the future as I'm currently trying to avoid any questions from the family.

You and Twisty have had some excellent suggestions and the two of you appear to be well on your way to freedom. Here's another bit of reading (some 11 minutes) that tends to shock JW's who listen. THE GREAT WATCHTOWER CONTRADICTION is based on quotations from Watchtower publications, designed for new ones, but is more than plenty thought-provoking for seasoned JWs. They don't want to meet up with the main question this one poses.

Len

16

question for older ex-elders

by scooterspank in

i have only just begun to talk to my father about why he left the truth.

i know why he stepped down as an elder many years ago but we have just scratched the surface about why he "faded" in his 60's i would say (he is now 74).

i just wonder how much leaving the "truth" that much later in life has an effect on depression, anxiety, anger (he joined in his 30's)?

FatFreek 2005

I am 71 but was only 37 when I announced my resignation as elder. So the last 1/3 century has been free (mostly) from the cult. Unfortunately, your dad has not had that much freedom and I empathize with him.

The problem, as I see it, with those that leave -- is many still feel they have left the truth. I can only hope that isn't the case with your father because he hasn't yet found true freedom.

I left because of having read the '75 yearbook. Well, there were other things, of course, but that yearbook was the catalyst.

The Watchtower yearbook recap of the 1925 debacle didn't work for me. They were clearly trying to soften their 1975 buildup and all their implications so they could potentially blame the flock once again. I could see cover-up and deception, their quoting an elderly sister (Anna McDonald, I think her name was) in how she recollected that many fell out in those post 1925 years because they had perceived 1925 as a certainty -- instead of a possibility. Ha! I could see Rutherford smiling from his grave, knowing fully well how he was the one -- in pages of Watchtower publications -- who had advertised all that certainty in the years before 1925.

For me, it wasn't leaving the truth, but just the opposite.

Len

85

New To Studying

by DylanBeam in

jw
friends

hi, i am new to studying with the jw's and would like to know they best way to start.

any suggestions?.

FatFreek 2005

Sab -- what a great Simpson episode. Any cult member should pay attention to the similarities.

HairyHeGoat -- what a courageous story -- yours that is. I actually had tears streaming down my face at the progress your husband made. Kudos to you and your patient, yet persistent nudging. Thanks for sharing. It may not affect the original poster but many lurkers can't help but sit up and take notice.

Len Miller

64

Help a lurking dub with doubts

by undercover in

i've been lurking about, checking out some of the evidence against the wtbs.

i am currently inactive but still an approved/baptized member.

i have seen all the 1914/607bce evidence; the blood transfusion quandry evidence; the current child abuse problem evidence and several other things that are damning to the wt doctrines.

FatFreek 2005

Hi Terry, and kudos to that list of 18 items -- a great recap.

14. 1975 was the last firm date set by the Governing Body and it failed too. A backlash began a crackdown and asserting of Authority grew.

Allow me to respectfully disagree (though slightly) with that single item, 14. Recall that a few years before 1975 had even begun, they must've felt they needed another 25 years or so to hedge their bet, extending their prediction to the end of the century

". . .Shortly, within our twentieth century, the "battle in the day of Jehovah" will begin against the modern antitype of Jerusalem, Christendom." The Nations Shall Know That I Am Jehovah - How? 1971, Chap. 12 pp. 216-217

Cheers, Len.

64

Help a lurking dub with doubts

by undercover in

i've been lurking about, checking out some of the evidence against the wtbs.

i am currently inactive but still an approved/baptized member.

i have seen all the 1914/607bce evidence; the blood transfusion quandry evidence; the current child abuse problem evidence and several other things that are damning to the wt doctrines.

FatFreek 2005

Hi 20571pnt428571 and congratulations on your eloquence. You seem to demonstrate, at first blush, that the GB has had the inside scoop on the book of Revelation. Your "legacy of truth", however, lacks a few details about deep Watchtower history -- one that should make you truly blush. Check out the following table -- and it's two accompanying charts.

Just those Beginning dates makes my head swim. To put those into persepective, let's chart those.

Finally, THE GREAT WATCHTOWER CONTRADICTION, while only an 11 minute read, is designed for new ones. Picture yourself, the old-timer, at the door this coming weekend and someone hands you that document. How would you, with all that seasoned knowledge of Watchtower history, respond to the simple question this poses?

Len

5

Yes, Virginia, there is a Faithful and Discreet Slave

by FatFreek 2005 in

"dear editor: i am 8 years old.. "some of my apostate friends say there is no faithful and discreet slave.. "papa says, 'if you see it in the watchtower it's so.'.

"please tell me the truth; is there a faithful and discreet slave.?.

"virginia knorr.. "115 west ninety-fifth street.".

FatFreek 2005

Hi Ziddina,

You're a welcome sight for sore eyes. Thanks.

Len

5

Yes, Virginia, there is a Faithful and Discreet Slave

by FatFreek 2005 in

"dear editor: i am 8 years old.. "some of my apostate friends say there is no faithful and discreet slave.. "papa says, 'if you see it in the watchtower it's so.'.

"please tell me the truth; is there a faithful and discreet slave.?.

"virginia knorr.. "115 west ninety-fifth street.".

FatFreek 2005

Thanks, LG.

And, how they've been both Jekyll and Hyde and Jekyll. They started out as Jekyll (a body or group), turned into Hyde (Russell by himself), then back into Jekyll. Just another one of their many flip-flop-flips. One of their returning to a "previous point of view" -- which they claim does not happen.

Remember what they said? "At times explanations given by Jehovah’s visible organization have shown adjustments, seemingly to previous points of view. But this has not actually been the case." The Watchtower (WT), 1981, 12/1 p. 27

Len

85

New To Studying

by DylanBeam in

jw
friends

hi, i am new to studying with the jw's and would like to know they best way to start.

any suggestions?.

FatFreek 2005

Your statements are curious -- almost contradictory:

Hi, I am new to studying with the JW's and would like to know they best way to start. Any Suggestions?

Then you say:

i have read the beliefs of JWs and attended meetings therefore this is my way to go.

You've had some good suggestions here, and a few nasty ones. I can't help but add this 11 minute reading, but it is for REALLY new ones. You should get one of those Watchtower Library CDs before proceeding because it will quote from some 20 places within Watchtower literature. Keep me honest by checking them out.

THE GREAT WATCHTOWER CONTRADICTION will suggest a single question for you to ask your teacher.

Len

5

Yes, Virginia, there is a Faithful and Discreet Slave

by FatFreek 2005 in

"dear editor: i am 8 years old.. "some of my apostate friends say there is no faithful and discreet slave.. "papa says, 'if you see it in the watchtower it's so.'.

"please tell me the truth; is there a faithful and discreet slave.?.

"virginia knorr.. "115 west ninety-fifth street.".

FatFreek 2005

"DEAR EDITOR: I am 8 years old.

"Some of my apostate friends say there is no Faithful and Discreet Slave.

"Papa says, 'If you see it in THE WATCHTOWER it's so.'

"Please tell me the truth; is there a Faithful and Discreet Slave.?

"VIRGINIA KNORR.

"115 WEST NINETY-FIFTH STREET."

VIRGINIA, your apostate friends are wrong. They have been affected by the skepticism of this ungodly internet age. They no longer believe what they read in the pages of our dear Watchtower. They think that nothing can exist which is not laden by facts and proof and evidence. All minds, Virginia, whether they be men's or children's, are little. In this great universe of ours man is a mere insect, an ant, in his intellect, as compared with the bountiful and ever-changing light, which we call NEW – as in New Light.

Yes, VIRGINIA, there is a Faithful and Discreet Slave. It exists as certainly as meetings and field service and conventions exist, and you know that they abound and give to your life its highest potential for life everlasting. Alas! how dreary would be the world if there were no Faithful and Discreet Slave. It would be as dreary as if there were no VIRGINIAS. There would be no childlike faith then, no poetry, no romance to make tolerable this existence. We should have no enjoyment, except in sense and sight. The eternal light with which childhood fills the world would be extinguished.

Not believe in a Faithful and Discreet Slave! You might as well not believe in prohibiting blood transfusions, 1914, and the Overlapping Generations! You might get your papa to hire men to watch all the Memorial celebrations in the entire world to catch more phoney partakers, but what would that prove? We know that they are mostly brain-damaged or mentally deranged. The most real things in the world are those that neither apostates or outsiders can see. Did you ever see demons whispering from your Smurf doll? Of course not, but that's no proof that they are not there. Nobody can conceive or imagine all the dangers that are unseeable in this wicked system outside the protective walls of your local Kingdom Hall.

You may tear apart the baby's rattle and see what makes the noise inside, but there is a veil covering the unseen world which not the strongest man, nor even the united strength of all the strongest men that ever lived, could tear apart. Only blind faith and naïve determination can assure you that the FDS is as real as Jim Jones and Harold Camping. Are they real? Ah, VIRGINIA, in all this world there is nothing else real and abiding.

No Faithful and Discreet Slave? Thank Jehovah it exists and it lives forever within this glorious ivory tower at Watchtower Headquarters. A thousand Overlapping Generations from now, Virginia, nay, ten times ten thousand Overlapping Generations from now, our dear Faithful and Discreet Slave will continue to embed the fear of shunning in the hearts of its gullible flock.

Your brothers in faithful service,

Watchtower Bible And Tract Society